• Attention: We are currently experiencing some issues with our emailing system. This may cause validation emails to not be sent, preventing some users from finishing registration. We apologize for the inconveince that this may cause, and are working to resolve it as soon as possible.

Why every online survival game dies? or: How to keep survival game alive?

Bojan

New member
I want to start a discussion with you on a, for me, a serious matter.

What do you think is the main reason most of the online survival games die?

We have DayZ that disappointed the large amount of community with broken promises and far behind schedule.

DayZ have:
-base building
-pve and pvp both balanced (vanilla)
-crafting
DayZ does not have:
-missions
-dynamic events
-new content

We have Miscreated that wanted to be american version of DayZ

Miscreated have:
-base building
-pve and pvp both/ but more focusing on pvp
-crafting
-dynamic weather effects and events.
Miscreated does not have:
-missions

I cannot talk much about SCUM since i just watched few videos and haven't really tried the game but there was a huge drop of player count before they added a new massive update but the main reason SCUM started to lose player count is because everyone felt like there is nothing much else to do.


Finally, i want to mention Rust, as maybe the most successful game out there and to my surprise, still pretty much alive game.

But why?

Rust is not even a hard core survival game. It is mostly focused on PVP.

Is it because they keep adding bunch of cool modular items in the game?


How to prevent losing players? Does it need to have missions? More dynamic events? More items?

What do you think?
 

Bourgmestre

New member
Comming from Conan Exiles i would say that it's all about player interactivity.

(in order to ilustrate better i'l use your display since english isn't my native language and it's easier for me that way)


Conan Exile have:
-base building
-pve and pvp with a strong emphasis on lore & roleplay
-crafting & cooking
-dynamic weather effects and events.
-Dungeons
-Thrall system (breaking any human into slavery for better craft and defend yourself)

There is a TON of props for decoration and a good amound of armor along with dye, and what keep it alive during the worst time of the game (a year ago) were strong private community build around various rules & setting adjustment (not to mention mods) that minimise bug and gamebreaking issue that were in place.

I don't know for rust but i do think if you give player way to adjust their fit as mutch as possible throu server admin setting or mods (even tho i tend to stick with vanilla setting on most game) is a good key for longevity.

Also, some choke point that force people to cooperate on specific task, so beligerant have other things to do than killing sometimes^^
 

KANOVALOV

New member
Hey gamers,

For me, this is what I personally think makes for a good zombie survival game:

-Looting, Scavenging. (The #1 thing that drives my interest is loot... The next house could have something epic, You'll never know until you look).
-Looting physical items is cool. Looting chests or cabinets is also cool, but I like looting stationary items just for that little attention to detail.
-The game must have all these:

  • Single Player Mode
    • Playing by myself in my own world.
  • Co-Op Mode
    • Playing with my wife together in our own world.
  • Private Multiplayer Server
    • Playing with friends online.
  • Public and community Multiplayer PVE/PVP
    • Playing in a PVP server as risk vs reward.
-I love finding weapons but not crafting them. (I just don't think it's realistic for any random person to craft a functional weapon from wood and metal)
-I love dynamic weather and especially rain. (I once fell asleep in a game when it started to thunder and rain, it sounded so realistic)
-I love making or finding ammo, and to manually load the magazines with bullets.

  • This is just a coolness factor. I find I cherish my ammo even more if I have to manually load every round into each magazine or clip.
  • With this being said, I'm not really a fan of just clicking "R" to top-off my current magazine. Yes, I play those games and it's fine for those high action shooters, but for a zombie survival game I just love the coolness factor of having to micromanage your magazines and rounds.
-Building a base, or take over a base to store loot and call a home.
-A ton of clothing choices: Gear, Armor, Vests, Backpacks, Helmets... Civilian clothing as well.
-The ability to play Male and Female characters, with unique cosmetics: Markings, scars, tattoos, piercings, height, weight...
-Both FPP & TPP
-Having just the right balance of weapons and ammo:

  • Not to be starved of weapons and ammo.
  • Not to be overloaded with weapons and ammo.
  • Able to use your weapons in everyday combat without having to worry about rationing ammo like in Resident Evil 1.
  • Finding rare and exotic weapons in dangerous places.
-Having someone else to shoot at other than zombies, like NPC mercenaries. I feel another NPC element to a zombie game could keep you on your toes a lot more.
-Able to drive and acquire vehicles.
-To have weapon modifications: (Scopes, Lasers, Flash Lights, Grips)
-Survival games love us being able to eat and drink, but I don't like anything too crazy where you can't enjoy the game because you're searching for water every 10 minutes.
-The game must have unique houses/buildings... something to admire while you're looting. I dislike when all buildings look the same and every room looks the same.
-If you die, you at least have a change to get to your body and acquire your gear before it vanishes.



Anyway that's a few of my thoughts.
Have a good one!
 

lee505

New member
Hey gamers,

For me, this is what I personally think makes for a good zombie survival game:

-Looting, Scavenging. (The #1 thing that drives my interest is loot... The next house could have something epic, You'll never know until you look).
-Looting physical items is cool. Looting chests or cabinets is also cool, but I like looting stationary items just for that little attention to detail.
-The game must have all these:

  • Single Player Mode
    • Playing by myself in my own world.
  • Co-Op Mode
    • Playing with my wife together in our own world.
  • Private Multiplayer Server
    • Playing with friends online.
  • Public and community Multiplayer PVE/PVP
    • Playing in a PVP server as risk vs reward.
-I love finding weapons but not crafting them. (I just don't think it's realistic for any random person to craft a functional weapon from wood and metal)
-I love dynamic weather and especially rain. (I once fell asleep in a game when it started to thunder and rain, it sounded so realistic)
-I love making or finding ammo, and to manually load the magazines with bullets.

  • This is just a coolness factor. I find I cherish my ammo even more if I have to manually load every round into each magazine or clip.
  • With this being said, I'm not really a fan of just clicking "R" to top-off my current magazine. Yes, I play those games and it's fine for those high action shooters, but for a zombie survival game I just love the coolness factor of having to micromanage your magazines and rounds.
-Building a base, or take over a base to store loot and call a home.
-A ton of clothing choices: Gear, Armor, Vests, Backpacks, Helmets... Civilian clothing as well.
-The ability to play Male and Female characters, with unique cosmetics: Markings, scars, tattoos, piercings, height, weight...
-Both FPP & TPP
-Having just the right balance of weapons and ammo:

  • Not to be starved of weapons and ammo.
  • Not to be overloaded with weapons and ammo.
  • Able to use your weapons in everyday combat without having to worry about rationing ammo like in Resident Evil 1.
  • Finding rare and exotic weapons in dangerous places.
-Having someone else to shoot at other than zombies, like NPC mercenaries. I feel another NPC element to a zombie game could keep you on your toes a lot more.
-Able to drive and acquire vehicles.
-To have weapon modifications: (Scopes, Lasers, Flash Lights, Grips)
-Survival games love us being able to eat and drink, but I don't like anything too crazy where you can't enjoy the game because you're searching for water every 10 minutes.
-The game must have unique houses/buildings... something to admire while you're looting. I dislike when all buildings look the same and every room looks the same.
-If you die, you at least have a change to get to your body and acquire your gear before it vanishes.



Anyway that's a few of my thoughts.
Have a good one!
You're talking about my dream survival game, but at least it's not there now.
 

acrosome

Active member
  • Single Player Mode
    • Playing by myself in my own world.
  • Co-Op Mode
    • Playing with my wife together in our own world.
  • Private Multiplayer Server
    • Playing with friends online.
  • Public and community Multiplayer PVE/PVP
    • Playing in a PVP server as risk vs reward.
The biggest use I have is co-op play with a group of friends of mine- now scattered all over the country- where the game becomes a sort of a conference call to catch up, but we also get to play a game.

-I love finding weapons but not crafting them. (I just don't think it's realistic for any random person to craft a functional weapon from wood and metal)


Well, any moron can make a zip gun or a slamfire shotgun. But in general, yes, the Kyber Pass level of crafting assault rifles using scrap metal like in Fallout is probably unreasonable.

-Having just the right balance of weapons and ammo:
  • Not to be starved of weapons and ammo
  • Not to be overloaded with weapons and ammo.
  • Able to use your weapons in everyday combat without having to worry about rationing ammo like in Resident Evil 1.
  • Finding rare and exotic weapons in dangerous places.


While I understand your intent, this isn't really helpful for game design. You're saying "Not too little of this, but not too much either." Well, what is too little or too much? Opinions will differ.


-Survival games love us being able to eat and drink, but I don't like anything too crazy where you can't enjoy the game because you're searching for water every 10 minutes.
I do sort of agree with you here, but again we need a definition.

Most games compress time so that you end up having to eat and drink constantly, and it just becomes an onerous chore. But OTOH a survival game needs a thirst and hunger mechanic. They just need to tone it down a bit, from what I have seen in the past. At the very least maybe base it on the 3-3-3 rule? In an average environment (whatever that is) it takes 3 days to die of thirst if you drink no water, so let you go a whole day before the smallest thirst debuff starts. Likewise, according to the common wisdom it takes 3 weeks to starve to death without eating any food, so start getting debuffs at about one week. (The first 3 was 3 minutes to die from lack of oxygen.) Mind you, none of these rules of 3 are hard rules in real life (see the survival TV show Naked and Afraid). And various smaller drinks or snacks along the way prolong things.

But this system has obvious issues, too. I don't have a perfect solution, if only because (again) opinions will differ.

One thing I would recommend is not having the water purification animations take a long time. There should be water everywhere in Alberta- it isn't Arizona after all. The issue is purifying it, so just don't have that consume too much play time. Don't make the player indulge in button-clicking to open a pack, remove a water container from it, and drink it- just assume that water gets cross loaded and move on. One button; maybe let players configure in what order water containers get emptied, like pack first, canteen last, or whatever. And make it easy to carry a lot- appropriate containers should be laying around everywhere, after all. In my cupboard right now we must have a dozen Nalgene-style 1L water bottles of various provenance. They get handed out for free at trade conferences, fer Chrissakes. Every dumpster will have scores of water bottles and probably a bunch of those more durable and thicker-walled grocery store juice jugs. And so on.

But from what little we have seen of the nutrition mechanic it looks pretty damned detailed. I'm willing to see how it goes before I start making recommendations to tweak it.
 

KANOVALOV

New member
Well, any moron can make a zip gun or a slamfire shotgun. But in general, yes, the Kyber Pass level of crafting assault rifles using scrap metal like in Fallout is probably unreasonable.

While I understand your intent, this isn't really helpful for game design. You're saying "Not too little of this, but not too much either." Well, what is too little or too much? Opinions will differ.
Great review.
What I really meant by saying this part was... If ammo is scarce, then you never fully get to use your weapons as much as you'd like. For example: carrying around an M14 for a week and can't finding any ammunition to even use it, and when you finally find ammo, you might end up stockpiling it, telling yourself you would use it later when you gather more. However, If you constantly find so much ammo it doesn't phase you to leave some behind, or you have so much ammo you waste it, shooting everything in sight for fun, I would then think that the ammo loot rate % is unbalanced.

What I would prefer is not being starved, but not having so much where I feel I might waste it goofing off. But to start the day knowing I might only have 55 rounds for my M14, and 45 rounds for my Glock, knowing I can survive and hold my own, but not take on a horde of zombies. This would definitely make me plan a strategy rather than run in guns blazing.
 

ZedMike

New member
I concur that single and co-op options are critical to a game's long-term survival, if for no other reason than to provide an on-ramp for new players as the game matures. I came late to the party with DayZ and discovered the game to be a merciless execution simulator where I never lived long enough to see a zombie, much less survive. The world is awash in PVP slaughter games, but those who are no good at PVP, or those who need some time to get familiar with the game, to gear up, etc., could in theory benefit from a less KOS environment than that which a lot of survival games evolve into. Like Acrosome above, I play as a 'conference call' with buddies, just something to screw around with while we talk, laugh and chill after a hard day at work. Sneaking around scavenging 2x4s might be all the action we need for an evening, or the problem-solving inherent in a survival scenario. Letting players choose their experience is always better than forcing the wishes of one group on another.
 

acrosome

Active member
Great review.
What I really meant by saying this part was... If ammo is scarce, then you never fully get to use your weapons as much as you'd like. For example: carrying around an M14 for a week and can't finding any ammunition to even use it, and when you finally find ammo, you might end up stockpiling it, telling yourself you would use it later when you gather more. However, If you constantly find so much ammo it doesn't phase you to leave some behind, or you have so much ammo you waste it, shooting everything in sight for fun, I would then think that the ammo loot rate % is unbalanced.

What I would prefer is not being starved, but not having so much where I feel I might waste it goofing off. But to start the day knowing I might only have 55 rounds for my M14, and 45 rounds for my Glock, knowing I can survive and hold my own, but not take on a horde of zombies. This would definitely make me plan a strategy rather than run in guns blazing.
Hmm. I certainly don't think it would be in-genre to walk around with an assault rifle and 270 rounds all the time (plus a few grenades because, y'know, grenades) so I guess I'm with you there. But even if the devs design things to aim for say 25-50 average rounds on hand somebody is still going to grind and grind until they have that assault rifle and hundreds of rounds. And conversely someone new to the game is going to struggle just to find any ammo. Etc. Ideally the availability of such things would be adjustable by the player, but you can't really do that in a game with a PvP element.

But yes, as I said, I know what you're saying in general, and I agree.

Also, conversely, if you really want to scrimp and scrounge and save up a ton of ammo to take on that one zombie-infested high-value site, you should be able to. What I'd love is a way to reload ammo. A realistic way to reload ammo- you have to scavenge your spent casings, cast bullets, find or make powder and primers, etc. Casings that are used over and over eventually split and are useless. Obviously, it would be much easier to make black powder than a modern double-base smokeless powder. Then, since shotgun shells are so tolerant of reloading and work just fine with black powder they would probably become preferred, but older cartridges that were originally black powder and used simple cast lead projectiles (.45-70, .45 Long Colt, .44-40, etc.) might see a renaissance as well, since such straight-walled cartridges are reasonable easy to fabricate in small lots from brass stock (made from melted-down cartridges) or even aluminum stock (melted-down anything aluminum, including soda cans). Heck, even .303 was originally black powder, wasn't it? Now there is a great reason to make all those old Lee-Enfields so popular and common! (I think they'd still need jacketed bullets, though.) Car batteries are a great source of lead. And perchlorates for primers are pretty simple to synthesize, too- a great use for a chemistry skill in the "skill tree" that the game doesn't have.

The game needs to have a skill tree. One with nothing that affects combat directly, of course.

Fulminates aren't terribly hard, but finding mercury might be a challenge, and they are far more risky than perchlorates. (For more than one reason.) Heck, a chemist should also be able to make cordite or other nitrocellulose-based propellants, for that matter. But then the game has to track sources of chemicals and whatnot, so I think I'd just stick with black powder. And a system that was detailed enough to recognize when cast metal bullets were being used at too high a velocity, so accuracy sucks as the lead is just stripped in the rifling and barrel fouling gets extreme, would be pretty neat.

Oh, and you mean one of the M305 Chinese clones that were imported into Canada in such large numbers rather than a real M14, right? This is Canada, Bro. :)
 
Last edited:

LtAscott

New member
I've asked about reloading/ammo crafting before too, they are not really into it, they plan to have enough ammo around for people to be able to find it, how much or how little that is depends, if there is no server provider server to server ammunition availability will be up tho whoever is hosting as far as I can tell, I also greatly dislike the vanilla DayZ experience where the dumb ass system spawns high tier guns everywhere for a day but then once those are looted after patch day they get harder and harder to find, let alone ammo and magazines, everyone hoards them and consolidates them in their bases, and either stops playing or whatever then it takes a month of 0 activity to despawn and their system doesn't spawn more because they are based on those hard counts. (the CLE is Terrible system).
Professions and traits I think will be the difference in Dead Matter as they lean more into how effective your character is and since one character can't be a "jack of all trades" due to no ability to progress or gain new skill sets, your profession choice greatly impacts your choice beyond a roleplay standpoint, and kind of discourages KOS interactions, you'd be a lot more likely to hold up the guy you saw running by and interact with him first rather than shoot right away if there was a chance he was say a mechanic that could fix your vehicle for the resources you already have instead of the ones your searching for, or your injured and the only way to lose an effect is if you find another player who was a doctor who can do a surgery on you to fix it (anyone can bandage a wound or pull out a piece of shrapnel thats just sticking in the skin but I'm not pulling a bullet out of my buddy's arm with the chance he bleeds out [irl examples]).
Will this be true in all cases? I doubt it, someone out there will just be wanting to quickly take you out and take your stuff, the "dungeon" themed locations they have should only be soloable after GREAT preparation, with lots of patience, and require skill. This way they are relatively 'easy' to tackle for prepared groups, 'Hard' for two people to do even if prepared, and NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE to do solo, if your after that high tier loot and know you cant get it without making a friend, you'll be trying to make a friend.
Those differences and interacting systems would steer people away from KOS interactions at least, cause a useful hostage is WAY more valuable than whatever is in their backpack when you already have a knife a sidearm and a 'primary' weapon. Weapons and ammunition like tasers, tranquilizer darts, net launchers, and stun/flash grenades would be WAY more valuable mid-high tier loot then because you have a better chance of progression through interaction without killing than you do just killing. You need to STEER players into behaving the way you want them to to make a survival game have longevity.
 

acrosome

Active member
Yes, I just commented on the perk/skill system on another thread. I think it would at least help promote co-op, and at least slightly reduce KOS, and I'm all for anything that does that. And the more granular the system is the more likely every player is to have their own "niche". One is the medic, of course. One is an actual doctor, and can do more advanced lifesaving, though probably not on himself, so he tends to avoid combat. (More basic first aid you should be able to do on yourself, but not surgery. And the doc is better at the basic stuff, too.)) Another works on cars, whereas some other guy works on electronics. One is a better (more nutritious) cook and food preserver. Maybe a better butcher? And so on. And yes, IMHO, one should be a chemist who can make primers and black powder for reloading!!! ...and biodiesel or ethanol for running the cars. I would imagine then that medical and chemistry people might be in good demand as partners. (Or hostages.) We might even see the medical people intentionally walking around with big red crosses on their clothes so that they are less likely to be KOSed.

The devs have said that they don't want an injury model that slows how fast you travel when injured, because "taking forever to walk across the map is no fun for anybody" or somesuch, but if they did and you had to find a doctor to fix your gimp leg that would sure encourage co-op and discourage lone-wolf KOSing, wouldn't it?


Give everyone their own special niche. Roleplaying gamers even call this "niche protection". As an example: there are fighters, there are thieves, and there are magic-users, but there are no fighter/thief/magic-users.

And absolutely NO perks/skills that improve combat effectiveness. In any game with PvP possibilities that should only depend on player skill. Perks that make you run a little faster or have a little better stamina would be tolerable.
 
Last edited:

LtAscott

New member
Perks that improve combat effectiveness make sense, your not going to shoot as well, or have the physical and mental endurance of someone who's military trained, or police trained, or a hunter, your not going to swing a baseball bat like a professional baseball player either, its not realistic, i know gameplay > realism in some cases, but augmented combat skills like holding your breath a little longer, knowing how to breakdown and clean and grease a weapon (better durability/less condition loss), reload faster, less dispersion (tighter bullet grouping), would make sense, things like aiming down sight speed, "snapping" to targets (a la state of decay 2 weapon skill), and similar things should not happen though I agree.
 

David

New member
I think that games really need to reward their players for going beyond simply surviving. Some stuff I've heard people talk about in the past are things like long-term but non-grindy goals, RPG elements, and world persistency. Something I've heard discussed less up until this thread was exploration like the unique buildings Kanovalov mentioned, and it's a really strong talking point.

I know that, in my experience, if a game isn't hitting the right marks for immersion and not hitting the right marks for rewards, or if the game is too grindy and tedious, I'll always bail on it. I'm sure other people are similar.

I know in games like PZ, DayZ, and SCUM, there's not alot of content to keep you occupied while you're travelling. There is also not much life to see in the world. The idea of NPCs is great. It also might be interesting if a combination of meta-game RTS between NPC factions and the AI features from STALKER are employed in order to make the world feel alive. Wastelanders is also a good example of filling out an empty world with at least enough content to keep players occupied.
 

acrosome

Active member
Well, Fallout 76 is VERY cinematic. It's not innately a challenge in itself, frankly. It just isn't that hard to stay alive and accrue tons of loot, so that's why there needs to be an NPC offering a "quest" on every street corner. I would hope that a decent, realistic survival game would offer it's own innate challenges in a way that Fallout never has, and that this would help keep people busy.

That being said, yes, a meta-plot plus short quests would be a good thing. But I just hope DM doesn't turn into Fallout, where every single NPC street urchin, barber, or farmer wants to give you an epic quest.
 
Last edited:

Eagle_JRiv

New member
Loot and PvP: Two key elements. And of course great optimization. Make sure the game runs great!!

playing vs AI is cool however, PvP is the juice that keeps it flowing, imo. How do you keep that interaction constant? Hot spots like missions is one great way! And a implementation of a clan/faction system. Imagine joining servers as a clan/faction to claim territory! Rent a server and have 4 clans/factions rule certain areas and raid others battle each other in missions ect! Let’s go!! https://playdeadmatter.com/forums/index.php?threads/clan-system.360/
 

Disturbed1

New member
I want to start a discussion with you on a, for me, a serious matter.

What do you think is the main reason most of the online survival games die?

We have DayZ that disappointed the large amount of community with broken promises and far behind schedule.

DayZ have:
-base building
-pve and pvp both balanced (vanilla)
-crafting
DayZ does not have:
-missions
-dynamic events
-new content

We have Miscreated that wanted to be american version of DayZ

Miscreated have:
-base building
-pve and pvp both/ but more focusing on pvp
-crafting
-dynamic weather effects and events.
Miscreated does not have:
-missions

I cannot talk much about SCUM since i just watched few videos and haven't really tried the game but there was a huge drop of player count before they added a new massive update but the main reason SCUM started to lose player count is because everyone felt like there is nothing much else to do.


Finally, i want to mention Rust, as maybe the most successful game out there and to my surprise, still pretty much alive game.

But why?

Rust is not even a hard core survival game. It is mostly focused on PVP.

Is it because they keep adding bunch of cool modular items in the game?


How to prevent losing players? Does it need to have missions? More dynamic events? More items?

What do you think?
I personally love the loot and survival aspect.Yea pvp is fun sometimes but sometimes you just want to look for loot and not find a bunch of cool stuff then get rushed from behind just to lose all of it,but i guess that keeps you on your toes.
 

acrosome

Active member
playing vs AI is cool however, PvP is the juice that keeps it flowing
Assuming that all other players are like you is an error. You're obviously a Killer, which is ok as long as your not just some pathetic griefer. But for me and many others PvP is definitely not the "juice that keeps it flowing". Disturbed1 sounds like an Achiever. I may not be typical, but in Bartle's taxonomy I guess I'm heavily an Explorer, with just a little Achiever and Socializer, and not much Killer except when it comes to revenge, when I can be relentless. (Yay! Some idiot just turned themselves into content!)

Because as an Explorer, for me it's all about the content. And the fun thing about base-building games is that in addition to checking out what the devs have made, you can more or less infinitely go around checking out what cool things the other players have come up with, too. Then you can keep trying new things with your own base. This is why I keep advocating for a complex base-building functionality, with many little traps being possible, and moveable world items, furniture and decorations, etc. Because if all you can do is put boards on the windows and locks on the doors then that's going to get boring really fast.

What are the rest of you?

P.S. Every gamer should watch everything that Extra Credits puts out. And every dev even more so, especially the discussion videos about quest design.
 
Last edited:

Eagle_JRiv

New member
Assuming that all other players are like you is an error. You're obviously a Killer, which is ok as long as your not just some pathetic griefer. But for me and many others PvP is definitely not the "juice that keeps it flowing". Disturbed1 sounds like an Achiever. I may not be typical, but in Bartle's taxonomy I guess I'm heavily an Explorer, with just a little Achiever and Socializer, and not much Killer except when it comes to revenge, when I can be relentless. (Yay! Some idiot just turned themselves into content!)

Because as an Explorer, for me it's all about the content. And the fun thing about base-building games is that in addition to checking out what the devs have made, you can more or less infinitely go around checking out what cool things the other players have come up with, too. Then you can keep trying new things with your own base. This is why I keep advocating for a complex base-building functionality, with many little traps being possible, and moveable world items, furniture and decorations, etc. Because if all you can do is put boards on the windows and locks on the doors then that's going to get boring really fast.

What are the rest of you?

P.S. Every gamer should watch everything that Extra Credits puts out.
Please don’t mistake my post as a knock to the explorers. If it came out that way my apologies. I to love to explore and build! Just imo, if the content is their awesome!! We will all get what we want. Another thing, that’s what custom servers will allow, my indulgence in PvP, territorial, killer type gameplay and your scavenge, build and explore gameplay. In which our servers will do both. 😉

In a nutshell for me and playing other survival games, PvP just adds to the gameplay because once you have done all the looting and building of the entire map, what else is there?
 

Dark Drakan

New member
When the endgame loot in most survival games leans more towards simply hording higher tier weapons and more ammo it pushes people into heading into PvP to make use of all of it. If the AI threat was enough to warrant using it on them instead of other players I think more people would stick around. When you have spent countless hours accumulating all the weapons, military gear, ammo and food you are essentially pushed into getting into gunfights with other players as you dont really have anything else to strive for. Then when you inevitably die in a shootout with other players you rinse and repeat the process until you get bored.

I have always preferred PvE gameplay but so few survival games have any decent PvE systems in place. Most dont have any sort of dynamic events systems, mission system or a form of intelligent AI. I still play DayZ frequently but havent played vanilla in many months as mods are making it SO much better & changing the experience drastically. Mods that have enabled zombie hordes, increased infected count, added loot to infected and tweaked overall loot spawns have changed the experience leaps and bounds.

When you actually have a reason to need to kill infected as they carry decent items on them that you might need for survival and with the increased spawn rates and hordes making you actually have to sneak around towns so you dont attract any it changes the attraction of PvP. If you happen to attract any infected its a real pain to shake them off and often pushes players have to team up or both die. Personally I believe pushing players into needing to team up for mutual benefit is better than just pushing them towards PvP to make use of weapons they have.

In a survival game I would want to be able to build a camp/claim a building, store what I need, be able to easily find that camp/building again and be able to easily group up with other players and friends and combat events that put us in danger. Things like dynamic horde spawns, dynamic weather changes, mission events, roaming AI bandits, roaming AI animals both passive and aggressive and factions would all add different unpredictable variables to the environment (I know many are confirmed already).

Also dont make cars almost impossible to find the countless parts for and then break easily, games should simply make fuel less common or space out the areas that it spawns. I dont mind it being a challenge to get a car running as it should be but I dont want to spend countless hours searching for something like a spark plug and countless other little items that im going to have to travel many km to find on foot which removes me wanting to return and get the car anyway. At least spawn them with all of their wheels, I dont want to have to essentially rebuild an entire car from scratch, bonnet, doors, lights etc before its of any real use to me.

Instead what we tend to get in most survival games is a static map that lacks any changing events with varying levels of loot areas that PvP players simply run towards every time they login to gear up and go hunting a deathmatch/Battle Royale fix. Players need surprise and unpredictable events that throw them off guard where they dont know what to expect each time they get to a new area.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom